southbankbornnbred
6:45 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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I don't doubt it. He looks a fine prospect.
I'm just not sure you take too many 17 year-old CM 'prospects' to major tournaments when the public expects you to get to the semis. Let's see in a few weeks.
A run-about in a meaningless pre-tournament friendly against Austria, where everybody will be avoiding injury, is not going to make or break him. Or England. I hope he plays tonight and plays well.
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Vexed
6:43 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Surely the idiot Southgate wont play two holding in games he wants to fucking win? Five at the back and two holding would be Moyes level negativity.
Even Southgate wouldn't be this much of a cunt. (Confidence in this statement: 0)
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Eerie Descent
6:36 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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If you've watched that Bellingham play and you can't see what the fuss is about, you should give up watching football.
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Northern Sold
6:30 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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The matches I have seen Bellingham play he looks an absolute gazelle….
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southbankbornnbred
6:14 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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I certainly wouldn't judge him based on any performance tonight.
I remember Oxlade-Chamberlain looking world-class in meaningless pre-tournament friendlies where nobody tackles and everybody is trying to avoid injury.
It would be unfair on the kid to judge him on that. Tonight is about keeping fitness levels up and getting the team used to each other in terms of organisation etc.
Croatia played Armenia the other night at half-pace and drew 1-1. I doubt that'll be their approach against England.
Bellingham is in the squad now, so there's no turning back the clock. I hope he does well. I have my doubts.
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fraser
6:04 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Bellingham looked very good when I've seen him. The pundits were suggesting he starts in the Euros
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Rossal
5:57 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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He was superb against City in the champs league.......and played well in the Bundesliga this season.....Dortmunds midfield is not pony and he has forced his away into the side
He will impress if he gets a chance, in fact he may start tonight?
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southbankbornnbred
5:47 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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And a 17 year-old won't have experienced any game like the ferocity of the England-Scotland match. That will be a kicking match in midfield: it's Scotland's only way of unsettling England.
So I just don't see the point of Bellingham in a squad which will play a ferocious derby match, and matches against hard-bitten fuckers like Soucek and Badelj, as well as control freaks like Modric etc. You need men in those games, not kids. Bellingham can't even vote yet.
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JOHNNY V
5:45 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Pickford
Walker Maguire Stones
Taa Saka
Rice Mount
Grealish Kane Foden
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southbankbornnbred
5:40 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Let's see.
I'll wager he gets eaten up by the first decent midfield he comes up against.
I sincerely hope I'm wrong. Clearly the kid has talent. But this is the real world, not Football Manager, and it's a hard task for any 17 year CM.
I accept he won't come across Kante too often. But I don't fancy him against Soucek and co for the Czechs, or Modcric and Badelj for Croatia, for example. And they are in our group.
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Rossal
5:32 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Bellingham has turned in some superb performances in the champions league this season
He might not get near Kante, but you are talking 1 game out of 7 whatever it is. For the other 6 he is good enough and ready enough to play some part and make an impact
I think he is the CM with the most balance between attacking and defending.......i'd probably back him to play over Phillips in some of the group games. I dont think he'll start many, but i think he is a great option off the bench
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southbankbornnbred
5:27 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Stepney - Bellingham has only played 90 minutes for Dortmund on 11 occasions.
He's more often either been a substitute or been substituted long before the end of games.
They're easing him in, as he's just 17.
But that doesn't tell me he's ready for a World Cup against the likes of Kante, Busquets and co. England had some other options more experienced at the highest level.
I'm sure the kid will be a fine player over time. But my gut feeling is that he will barely kick a ball this summer and will be too inexperienced to make a big difference. I hope I'm wrong, of course. I'd love to see him dominate. But history is not on his side. Not in that tough position he plays.
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chedylan 2
5:21 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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gareth barry 2010, hobbles out of plane in joburg on crutches whilst scott parker is left out.
2 weeks later gareth barry walking back from the german penalty area as germany break for their 4th goal.
its the sqame rinse and repeat, all the england managers lose it, for their favourites.
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Westham67
5:20 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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That is a stupid pick. He should be concentrating on the next tournament coming up not 2 to 4 years down the line
Our benefit is Lingard will not play a blinder in the Euros and his price 30%
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stepney hammer
5:18 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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I wouldn't play Phillips, don't see the hype. Don't need him and Rice in the same side either.
Bellingham despite his age now has two full seasons under his belt, this past one playing every week in the Bundesliga and Champions League. I'd have no problem starting him. Him and Rice would be the starting pair for me.
He will of course though start a below par Henderson who is well short of match fitness.
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chedylan 2
5:17 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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you are right, every england manager seems to do this before a tournement, and they all seem to completely loose their minds after a couple of years in the job.
i dont want to hear any more work in progress, building for the future bullshit thats spun since at least 2012.
just go and and fucking win something with your best team, if you fail, fuck off and get a manager that can.
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southbankbornnbred
5:12 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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I don't get the choice of Bellingham. I don't understand these regular 'jack in the box' decisions to take an untried 17 year-old to a major tournament. It reminds me of when we took Walcott to the 2006 World Cup and he just fetched drinks for two months.
I'm sure Bellingham will be a good player as he matures. But he has played two-thirds of his professional starts in the Championship for Brum and has made more appearances from the bench so far for Dortmund.
He looks a fine prospect, but he is still entirely unproven at the highest level. Even Owen (in '98) and Rooney (2004) had played all of their games at the highest level, and put full seasons behind them in the Prem before they burst onto the scene with England.
There's a big difference between playing against Luton's midfield for Brum, and coming up against N'golo Kante in a France shirt.
For me, it's too early for Bellingham. But players like him are Southgate's get-out clause. He keeps picking ever younger sides/squads, so that he can always argue that England are a team in transition and 'building for the future'. It takes pressure off him, which is good for him. But he's been in the job five years now and, even without the teenagers, this is a talented group of players (albeit not world-class).
At some point Southgate has to throw his cards on the table and deliver something meaningful. I know he took England to the semi-finals in 2018, which was unexpectedly good, but we lost three games at that tournament. In fact, we lost every moderately difficult or difficult game we played: Belgium twice and Croatia.
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Rossal
4:28 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Henderson hasnt played since Feb surely it will take him 2 games minimum to get up to speed.......we cant afford that he isnt that good
If you play 2 CDM go with Philips or even Bellingham.... he is superb at winning the ball back and also good going forward
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southbankbornnbred
3:49 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Conversely, you need a combination of Rice and Henderson when you know you're going to have to spend a lot of time pressing the opposition and winning back the ball from skillful midfields.
Horses for courses, innit.
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southbankbornnbred
3:47 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Henderson is a fine player - but he does his best work when his team doesn't have the ball.
So does Rice.
England will waste this attacking generation if all they do is play two dogs of war in the middle of the park against weaker sides. That's when they trip up and lose, or draw, games they should win.
They need someone who is going to drop deep, build from the back and actually pick out Foden, Grealish, Sterling or Mount.
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southbankbornnbred
3:42 Wed Jun 2
Re: Lingard Dropped for Euros
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Vexed, you should be wrong - but I think you're right. Southgate will probably favour Henderson and Rice together.
That's fine when you have to go hunting the ball against the likes of France and Spain. But there's little point having two players like that when you are playing sides you can and should dominate, like Scotland. That's when we need to keep the ball and pass it well - and Phillips is the better option for that. His passing range is excellent and, the way Leeds play, his first thought is to look for his attacking full-backs going past him.
Phillips gives us opportunities to keep the ball on hot days, and pick out better passes from deep positions.
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